Wikidata:Property proposal/La Grange ID
La Grange person ID
[edit]Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control
| Description | Identifier for a person in the La Grange database of people of the Comédie-Française |
|---|---|
| Data type | External identifier |
| Example 1 | Armande Béjart (Q460831) 3397 |
| Example 2 | Marie Champmeslé (Q2620439) 3406 |
| Example 3 | Adrienne Lecouvreur (Q237201) 3461 |
| Formatter URL | https://comedie-francaise.bibli.fr/index.php?lvl=author_see&id=$1 |
Motivation
[edit]La Grange is the institutional historical database of the Comédie-Française, the oldest active theater company in the world (founded in 1680). It provides highly authoritative, comprehensive records of the actors, directors, playwrights who have shaped French theater history from the 17th century to the present day. Connecting Wikidata items to La Grange creates a direct link to the primary historical records of the Comédie-Française. It ensures long-term reference reliability for theatrical biographies. A dedicated identifier will allow automated cross-referencing between Wikidata, Wikipedia authorities, and La Grange's data. This will instantly enrich thousands of biographies of historical and contemporary theater professionals with structured performance histories. William C. Minor (talk)
Discussion
[edit]
Question What does "title" refer to in the proposed property label and description? Is the property not an identifier for a person? -- Yirba (talk) 22:09, 28 June 2026 (UTC)
- Indeed it is, Yirba. Of course, I meant to write "person". Thank you for your diligence. William C. Minor (talk) 22:17, 30 June 2026 (UTC)
Support I would strongly support the addition of this database. I think it would add valuable context to relevant articles. Jaucourt (talk) 20:36, 1 July 2026 (UTC)
- Question Have you considered using the permanent link for entries as the formatter URL? (e.g. https://comedie-francaise.bibli.fr/ark:/63615/5xvfd40k22). Any reason not to use that instead? -- HelloImSteven (talk) 14:45, 4 July 2026 (UTC)
- @HelloImSteven, this should be avoided under any circumstances. Who wants another 'permanent' link situation? 'Permanent' Links are never as permanent as we would like. IDs are significantly more stable . William C. Minor (talk) 20:54, 4 July 2026 (UTC)
- Sorry, but that doesn't make sense to me. The permalinks on that site use Archival Resource Key (Q2860403)s, which are persistent identifiers. Permalinks are designed to be stable. Sure, sometimes the links can break, but that can be true for other types of ID too. At least the intention is that they should be stable. That said, given that we already have Archival Resource Key (P8091), I'm not sure we necessarily need a separate property for the permalinks on this site. Yirba (talk) 21:27, 4 July 2026 (UTC)
- All right, @HelloImSteven. Please use the Archival Resource Key (P8091) on the 3 examples I provided in my request (Armande Béjart, Marie Champmeslé, Adrienne Lecouvreur), and let's see how you cross-reference them between Wikidata and the fr.Wikipedia authority notice. Thank you. William C. Minor (talk) 07:08, 6 July 2026 (UTC)
- I've added the statements, but if by "authority notice" you mean fr:Module:Autorité, I expect that could be updated if the French Wikipedia community wants that. Yirba (talk) 08:07, 6 July 2026 (UTC)
- All right, @HelloImSteven. Please use the Archival Resource Key (P8091) on the 3 examples I provided in my request (Armande Béjart, Marie Champmeslé, Adrienne Lecouvreur), and let's see how you cross-reference them between Wikidata and the fr.Wikipedia authority notice. Thank you. William C. Minor (talk) 07:08, 6 July 2026 (UTC)
- Support The IDs you used are already derived from a URL, so I was asking why that URL rather than the one embedded in the page content. However, thanks to @Yirba’s note that a separate property already exists, I see the two identifiers are related but distinct. While Archival Resource Key (P8091) can point to the same record, it carries little semantic meaning without additional qualifiers that may not be modelled consistently. La Grange author ID would encode the type of external record (an author), supporting easier querying with more reliable results. HelloImSteven (talk) 16:34, 6 July 2026 (UTC)
- Thank you @HelloImSteven. You are right, those persons already have a Comédie-Française ID. An ID pointing to the La Grange database should, however, be labeled "La Grange person ID", because it points to actors, directors, playwrights rather than authors. I have corrected the title of the request accordingly. Thanks again. William C. Minor (talk) 17:48, 6 July 2026 (UTC)
- Sorry, but that doesn't make sense to me. The permalinks on that site use Archival Resource Key (Q2860403)s, which are persistent identifiers. Permalinks are designed to be stable. Sure, sometimes the links can break, but that can be true for other types of ID too. At least the intention is that they should be stable. That said, given that we already have Archival Resource Key (P8091), I'm not sure we necessarily need a separate property for the permalinks on this site. Yirba (talk) 21:27, 4 July 2026 (UTC)
- @HelloImSteven, this should be avoided under any circumstances. Who wants another 'permanent' link situation? 'Permanent' Links are never as permanent as we would like. IDs are significantly more stable . William C. Minor (talk) 20:54, 4 July 2026 (UTC)
- @William C. Minor, Yirba, Jaucourt, HelloImSteven:
Created as La Grange person ID (P14643). Regards, ZI Jony (Talk) 06:32, 7 July 2026 (UTC)
- Thanks for the great work, @ZI Jony! William C. Minor (talk) 23:33, 7 July 2026 (UTC)